他盖这层楼是为看守 园圃,不是为上那几个屋顶。
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他盖这层楼是为看守 园圃,不是为上那几个屋顶。
that he built the upper story to protect the garden [tarbitza], not to access the roofs.
← 移入纹卷总目·第九章 凡屋顶
这不是译本,是辅读层。中文承载文本本身,并逐句标出哪些是塔木德自己的话、 哪些是 施泰因扎尔茨 补入的解释,以及哪些地方翻译必然有所流失。
谢法利亚 的 威廉·戴维森 版用 <b> 标出塔木德原文,其余为
施泰因扎尔茨 补入。下面的比例是逐句从这个标记算出来的,不是判断。
这一面每读 13 句,只有一句以塔木德自己的话为主。把这件事藏起来, 读者会以为自己读的是塔木德;标出来,他才知道自己站在哪里。
他盖这层楼是为看守 园圃,不是为上那几个屋顶。
他盖这层楼是为看守 园圃,不是为上那几个屋顶。
that he built the upper story to protect the garden [tarbitza], not to access the roofs.
拉米·巴尔·哈马 提出一疑:照 拉夫——他执定人在各个屋顶上只可在四肘之内搬物——那么人在一个屋顶上搬了两肘、又在挨着那屋顶一根高十掌宽四掌的柱子上搬两肘,那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?拉巴 说:他所疑的是哪一层呢?他是就 区间区 与私人区提这一疑么?那屋顶是 区间区,那柱子是私人区;从这一处搬到那一处断然是不许的。
拉米·巴尔·哈马 提出一疑:照 拉夫——他执定人在各个屋顶上只可在四肘之内搬物——那么人在一个屋顶上搬了两肘、又在挨着那屋顶一根高十掌宽四掌的柱子上搬两肘,那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?
Rami bar Ḥama raised a dilemma: According to Rav, who holds that one may carry only within four cubits on each roof, if he carries an object two cubits on a roof and another two cubits on a pillar ten handbreadths high and four handbreadths wide adjacent to the roof, what is the halakha?
拉巴 说:他所疑的是哪一层呢?
Rabba said: With regard to what matter is he raising a dilemma?
他是就 区间区 与私人区提这一疑么?
Is it with regard to a karmelit and a private domain that he is raising a dilemma?
那屋顶是 区间区,那柱子是私人区;从这一处搬到那一处断然是不许的。
The roof is a karmelit and the pillar is a private domain; certainly carrying from one to the other is prohibited.
革玛拉 讲明:他所疑的其实不是这一层;拉米·巴尔·哈马 因心思太快,没有把这一疑细想过,措辞就不准了。他所提的乃是这一疑:人在一所房子的屋顶上搬了两肘,又在别人房前一处门廊——就是有顶无墙的一处——的斜顶上搬两肘,那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?
革玛拉 讲明:他所疑的其实不是这一层;拉米·巴尔·哈马 因心思太快,没有把这一疑细想过,措辞就不准了。
The Gemara explains that this was not in fact the dilemma, and Rami bar Ḥama, due to his keen mind, did not analyze the dilemma carefully and was imprecise in its formulation.
他所提的乃是这一疑:人在一所房子的屋顶上搬了两肘,又在别人房前一处门廊——就是有顶无墙的一处——的斜顶上搬两肘,那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?
Rather, this is the dilemma he is raising: If one carries an object two cubits on the roof of a house, and another two cubits on the slanted roof of a portico, a roofed structure without walls, before a house belonging to someone else, what is the halakha?
革玛拉 把 拉米·巴尔·哈马 这一疑细说:我们要不要说——这屋顶既不宜住人、那门廊的顶也不宜住人,两下便算作一区,因而许人在其间搬物呢?还是说:从这一个屋顶搬到那一个屋顶既是不许的,那么从屋顶搬到门廊也照样不许,因它也自成一区呢?
革玛拉 把 拉米·巴尔·哈马 这一疑细说:我们要不要说——这屋顶既不宜住人、那门廊的顶也不宜住人,两下便算作一区,因而许人在其间搬物呢?
The Gemara elaborates on Rami bar Ḥama’s dilemma: Do we say that since neither this roof is fit for residence, nor is this portico roof fit for residence, it is regarded as one domain, and therefore carrying between them is permitted?
还是说:从这一个屋顶搬到那一个屋顶既是不许的,那么从屋顶搬到门廊也照样不许,因它也自成一区呢?
Or perhaps since carrying from a roof to another roof is prohibited, carrying from a roof to a portico is likewise prohibited, as the latter is also a domain in and of itself.
拉夫贝拜·巴尔·阿巴耶 提出一疑相类的:人在一所房子的屋顶上搬了两肘,又在别人一片废墟的顶上搬两肘——那废墟有一面全然向公共区敞着——那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?
拉夫贝拜·巴尔·阿巴耶 提出一疑相类的:人在一所房子的屋顶上搬了两肘,又在别人一片废墟的顶上搬两肘——那废墟有一面全然向公共区敞着——那条 哈拉哈 是怎样呢?
Rav Beivai bar Abaye raised a similar dilemma: If one carries two cubits on the roof of a house and another two cubits on the roof of a ruin belonging to someone else, one side of which was completely open to a public domain, what is the halakha?
拉夫卡哈纳 说:这岂不正是 拉米·巴尔·哈马 论门廊所提的那一疑么?拉夫贝拜·巴尔·阿巴耶 说:我岂是 后到、单为争闹、插手别人的疑问么?并不是这样,因这两疑本不一样。门廊不宜住人,废墟却宜住人。所以两样的 哈拉哈 或者有别。
拉夫卡哈纳 说:这岂不正是 拉米·巴尔·哈马 论门廊所提的那一疑么?
Rav Kahana said: Is that not precisely the same dilemma raised by Rami bar Ḥama with regard to a portico?
拉夫贝拜·巴尔·阿巴耶 说:我岂是 后到、单为争闹、插手别人的疑问么?
Rav Beivai bar Abaye said: And did I come late [me’aḥer] merely to quarrel, and meddle in other people’s questions?
并不是这样,因这两疑本不一样。
That is not the case, as the two dilemmas are not identical.
门廊不宜住人,废墟却宜住人。
A portico is not fit for residence, while a ruin is fit for residence.
所以两样的 哈拉哈 或者有别。
Therefore, the halakha might differ in each case.
革玛拉 就这一解诧异说:它既宜住人,他所疑的又是什么呢?那与两个寻常屋顶的情形一样。答说:拉夫贝瓦伊 并不晓得 拉米·巴尔·哈马 那一疑怎样解,所以他提这一疑是用「你若说」的说法。你若说门廊不宜住人、因而许人搬物,那么废墟既宜住人,它的顶就当与寻常屋顶一样。还是说不然——因那废墟无论如何眼下并没有住户,所以它的顶与寻常屋顶比不得。这几疑并没有寻着断法,就悬着。
革玛拉 就这一解诧异说:它既宜住人,他所疑的又是什么呢?
The Gemara is surprised by this explanation: And now that it is fit for residence, what dilemma is he raising?
那与两个寻常屋顶的情形一样。
The situation is comparable to the case of two standard roofs.
答说:拉夫贝瓦伊 并不晓得 拉米·巴尔·哈马 那一疑怎样解,所以他提这一疑是用「你若说」的说法。
The Gemara answers: Rav Beivai was unaware of the resolution to the dilemma raised by Rami bar Ḥama, and therefore, he states the dilemma employing the style: If you say.
你若说门廊不宜住人、因而许人搬物,那么废墟既宜住人,它的顶就当与寻常屋顶一样。
If you say that a portico is not fit for residence, and therefore carrying is permitted, it can be argued that as a ruin is fit for residence, the legal status of its roof should be like that of a standard roof.
还是说不然——因那废墟无论如何眼下并没有住户,所以它的顶与寻常屋顶比不得。
Or perhaps that is not the case, as now in any event there are no residents in the ruin, and therefore its roof is not comparable to a standard roof.
这几疑并没有寻着断法,就悬着。
No resolution was found for these dilemmas, and they stand unresolved.
革玛拉 论另一件。论那几个高低相齐的屋顶、就是彼此相差不到十掌的(依 拉比梅伊尔 的意思),或是一个不与别的屋顶相连的孤屋顶(依众贤者的意思):拉夫 说人在整个屋顶上搬物是许的;撒母耳 说人在它上头只可在四肘之内搬物。
革玛拉 论另一件。
The Gemara discusses a different question.
论那几个高低相齐的屋顶、就是彼此相差不到十掌的(依 拉比梅伊尔 的意思),或是一个不与别的屋顶相连的孤屋顶(依众贤者的意思):拉夫 说人在整个屋顶上搬物是许的;撒母耳 说人在它上头只可在四肘之内搬物。
With regard to roofs that are level, i.e., with a height disparity of less than ten handbreadths, according to the opinion of Rabbi Meir, or an isolated roof that does not border other roofs, according to the opinion of the Rabbis, Rav said: It is permitted to move an object throughout the entire roof; and Shmuel said: One may move an object in it only within four cubits.
革玛拉 要把两说的相碍之处讲明。拉夫 说人在整个屋顶上搬物是许的。这就有难处了,因 拉夫 这一句与 拉夫 那一句看去彼此相碍。论高低相齐的几个屋顶,拉夫 说过:照众贤者,人在各个屋顶上只可在四肘之内搬物。答说:那里、就是众屋顶之中的一个屋顶,各家之间里头那几道隔断并不显然,所以不算数。这里却不然:一所房子或一片房子外围那几道隔断是显然的,所以看作顺上去、把那屋顶的边界划了出来。
革玛拉 要把两说的相碍之处讲明。
The Gemara seeks to clarify the conflicting opinions.
拉夫 说人在整个屋顶上搬物是许的。
Rav said that it is permitted to move objects throughout the entire roof.
这就有难处了,因 拉夫 这一句与 拉夫 那一句看去彼此相碍。
This is difficult, as there is an apparent contradiction between one statement of Rav and another statement of Rav.
论高低相齐的几个屋顶,拉夫 说过:照众贤者,人在各个屋顶上只可在四肘之内搬物。
With regard to level roofs, Rav said that according to the Rabbis one may carry on each roof only within four cubits.
答说:那里、就是众屋顶之中的一个屋顶,各家之间里头那几道隔断并不显然,所以不算数。
The Gemara answers: There, in the case of a roof among roofs, the inner partitions between the houses are not conspicuous, and therefore, are not taken into consideration.
这里却不然:一所房子或一片房子外围那几道隔断是显然的,所以看作顺上去、把那屋顶的边界划了出来。
Here, however, the outer partitions of a single house or group of houses are conspicuous, meaning that they are considered to extend upward and delineate the edge of the roof.
革玛拉 回来论 撒母耳 那一断。撒母耳 说人只可在四肘之内搬物。这又有难处了,因 撒母耳 这一句与 撒母耳 那一句看去彼此相碍——他说过论高低相齐的几个屋顶,照众贤者,人在各个屋顶上通着搬物是许的。答说:那里,那屋顶的面积不过两 塞亚之地;这里,面积却过了两 塞亚之地。而那房子的几道墙,本是为底下所用、作那住处的隔断立的,并不是为上头屋顶上所用立的。所以那几道墙纵看作顺上去、给那屋顶围成隔断,那屋顶律法上的身分仍如一处过了两 塞亚之地、又不是从起头就为住人而围起来的围场;所凭的通则是:凡过了两 塞亚之地 而不是从起头为住人围起来的围场,人在其中只可在四肘之内搬物。
革玛拉 回来论 撒母耳 那一断。
The Gemara returns to discuss Shmuel’s ruling.
撒母耳 说人只可在四肘之内搬物。
And Shmuel said: One may carry only within four cubits.
这又有难处了,因 撒母耳 这一句与 撒母耳 那一句看去彼此相碍——他说过论高低相齐的几个屋顶,照众贤者,人在各个屋顶上通着搬物是许的。
Once again, it is difficult, as there is an apparent contradiction between one statement of Shmuel and another statement of Shmuel, who said that in the case of level roofs, according to the Rabbis one may carry throughout each separate roof.
答说:那里,那屋顶的面积不过两 塞亚之地;这里,面积却过了两 塞亚之地。
The Gemara answers: There, the area of the roof is no greater than two beit se’a; whereas here, the area is greater than two beit se’a.
而那房子的几道墙,本是为底下所用、作那住处的隔断立的,并不是为上头屋顶上所用立的。
And these partitions of the house were erected for use below as partitions for the residence itself; they were not erected to serve as partitions for use on the roof above.
所以那几道墙纵看作顺上去、给那屋顶围成隔断,那屋顶律法上的身分仍如一处过了两 塞亚之地、又不是从起头就为住人而围起来的围场;所凭的通则是:凡过了两 塞亚之地 而不是从起头为住人围起来的围场,人在其中只可在四肘之内搬物。
Consequently, even if the walls are viewed as extending upward so that they constitute surrounding partitions for the roof, the legal status of the roof is like that of an enclosure greater than two beit se’a that was not enclosed from the outset for the purpose of residence; and the principle is that with regard to any enclosure greater than two beit se’a that was not enclosed from the outset for the purpose of residence, one may move an object in it only within four cubits.
又有一说:这几位 阿摩拉 就一只大船相争。拉夫 说:人在整只船上搬物是许的,因通船算作一区;撒母耳 说:人在船上只可在四肘之内搬物。革玛拉 接着把两位的意思讲明。拉夫 说人在整只船上搬物是许的,
又有一说:这几位 阿摩拉 就一只大船相争。
It was further stated that these same amora’im disagreed with regard to a large ship.
拉夫 说:人在整只船上搬物是许的,因通船算作一区;撒母耳 说:人在船上只可在四肘之内搬物。
Rav said: It is permitted to move an object throughout the entire ship, as it is all one domain; and Shmuel said: One may move an object in it only within four cubits.
革玛拉 接着把两位的意思讲明。
The Gemara proceeds to clarify their respective opinions.
拉夫 说人在整只船上搬物是许的,
Rav said: It is permitted to move an object throughout the boat,